- Mark of Khorne for Skin Wolves gives Strength Bonus (1) when charging.
- Crom may upgrade marauders to elite marauders without any restrictions, but they may not be given Marks. Can choose either +3 A or 4+ parry. 250 pts.
- Archaon must re-roll results of 1-2 on the Eye of the Gods table.
- Wulfrik hits and wounds on a 2+ in challenges.
- Will of Chaos is not removed if you take a Mark.
- Revised cost for Marks on Marauders.
- Storm Rage removed, is simply Immunity (Lightning Attacks).
- Sorcerers may ride in normal Chaos Chariots.
- Fireglaives are polearms instead of spears.
- Mantle of Chaos only works against non-magical missile attacks, 55 pts.
- Sigvald has the Diabolic Splendour and Allure of Slaanesh power, 335 pts.
- Vilitch have the Conjoined Humuncolous power, 380 pts.
- Khorne Daemon Princes may take up 100 pts of magic items.
- Palanquin have WS2, S2, A8.
- Warshrine 100 pts. Favour of Slaanesh gives the target Immunity (Psychology). MoS unit gains Unbreakable instead.
- Kordel Shorgaar's banners makes the unit he joins Unbreakable, not stubborn.
- Hellshriek adds D3 to the result rolled on the miscast table.
- Valkia has a 5+ ward save, 350 pts.
- Gorebeast chariots have a 2+ armour save, 125 pts.
This pretty massive update changes the following:
- Diabolic Splendour gives forces enemies re-roll successful Leadership tests.
- War Mammoths cannot take Marks. Stomp result causes 3D6 hits.
- Chaos Trolls does not have Mark of Chaos Undivided.
- Fixed bug with Chaos Sorcerer levels not being written out.
- Chaos Sorcerers 100 pts. Sorcerers Lords 215 pts.
- Festus 215 pts.
- Additional hand weapons for Warriors and Chosen cost 1 pt. They cannot take both shields and another weapon, have shields by default, 16 pts.
- Marauders can swap shields for additional hand weapons for free.
- Lances for various cavalry cost 2 pts.
- Mark of Slaanesh for Knights cost 2 pts.
- Fatemasters affect friendly units, rather than models. Corrected names in the Coven of Tzeentch special rule. Are W2, 46 pts.
- Warshrine can cast spells with an 18" range. Favour of Slaanesh allow re-rolls of Psychology and Break tests, Charge and a pursuit distances. Favour of Tzeentch allow re-rolls of 1's when taking ward saves in addition to the 6+ ward.
- Giant of Khorne upgrade cost 15 pts.
- Hellfire Sword 35 pts.
- Crown of Everlasting Conquest 50 pts.
- Blood Boil does not work on Forest Spirits.
- Galrauch has a 6+ ward in addition to Mark of Tzeentch, 525 pts.
- Marauder Chariot 65 pts.
- Taking a Mark of Chaos replaces the Will of Chaos special rule.
- Valkia has A5, 335 pts.
- Blightkings, Skullreapers and Wrathmongers are not skirmishers by default, can upgrade to it for free.
- Slaughterbrute 205 pts.
- Mutalith Vortex Beast 240 pts.
- Wulfrik the Wanderer has A4, Killing Blow in challenges, 140 pts.
- Death Heads for Pusgoyle Blightlords 7 pts.
- Palanquin of Nurgle 25 pts.
- Mantle of Chaos 55 pts.
- Bestial Visage 10 pts.
- Extra Arm cannot be combined with Tentacle.
- Hellshriek affects all enemy Wizards within 18", 50 pts.
- Chaos Daemonsword 50 pts.
- Diabolic Splendour forces enemy units in base contact to re-roll successful Leadership tests, cost 20 pts. Cannot be combined with Fearsome Aura.
- Scaled Skin cost 20 pts.
- Mantle of Chaos halves the Strength of any missile attack targeting it halved, rounding up. This means that bows will be S2, rather than S1 on average.
- Blood Fever 25 pts.
- Crom gets +2 attacks when using two hand weapons, or a 5+ parry if using his shield. This replaces his old Way of the Warrior rule.
- Putrid Blightkings have the bountiful blades special rule, allowing them to swap weapons between each round of close combat.
- Kholek Suneater is S7, Starcrusher is a great weapon.
- Mark of Khorne for Skin Wolves cost 2 pts, give +1S in the first round of close combat. Mark of Slaanesh cost 2 pts. Mark of Tzeentch cost 1 pt.
- Disc of Tzeentch have Fly again.
- Chaos Chariots have Barding, 100 pts.
- Gorebeast Chariot is a separate unit entry, 5W, 120 pts.
- Chaos Sorcerer Lords may not ride chariots.
- Chaos Warriors and Chaosen may take flails.
- Kordel Shoorgar may ride Daemonic Mount.
- Distendable Maw moved to generic powers, Conjoined Humuncolous moved to Tzeentch powers.
- Clarified that Book of Secrets does not give you access to any additional signature spells. It gives +1 to channel power dice, but do not channel any dispel dice. If the bearer ever miscasts, roll 2D6 on the Miscast table and choose the highest result, 25 pts.
- Skullcrushers are T4, not T5, 73 pts.
- Crimson Armour of Dargan only protects from Killing Blow and Multiple Wounds in close combat.
- Slaughterpriest has MR(1), gets +1 to dispel, 115 pts.
- Acquiescence is 7+ to cast.
- For each Marauder Chieftain included in your army, you may give one unit of Marauders or
- Marauder Horsemen a Magic Standard worth up to 25 points.
- Adjusted points cost for marks for marauders.
- Marauder Champions removed, are now an upgrade called Elite Marauders that can be given to Chaos Marauders and Marauder Horsemen for 1,5 pts.
- Cultists are Expendable.
- Forsaken count towards Core.
- Daemons of Khorne have Magic Resistance (1) and +1 Strength when charging (except mounts). Daemon of Nurgle gives -1 WS to enemies in base contact. Daemons of Slaanesh do not re-roll 1's to hit. All Daemon Prince upgrades free, default cost 265 pts.
- All daemonic mounts (except Disc) have the the "Daemon of..." rule.
- Collar of Khorne gives MR(2), cost 20 pts.
- Clarified that Bloodcurling Roar is a missile attack, 25 pts.
- Fury of the Blood God gives Hatred in addition to -D3 to cast, 25 pts.
- Fixed some minor bugs, spelling and grammar issues.
Reading through the book once again. Ther was a lot of good changes overall I think. Some ideas, comments and suggestions though:
ReplyDelete-IF it is indeed so that MoK and MoS are 0.5 points better than the MoT and MoN, then you might as well let them all benefit from the Will of Chaos, so that they all come out more equal I think. It is rather nice if all the Marks of the Gods are as "equal" as possible I think.
-Crimson armour of dargan has a spelling mistake in the rules. The Ward save is supposed to be constant or just in close combat as well?
-Chaos Demonsword is still not worth it I think.. Yes, under the right circumstances it can perhaps do well, but if you know that a lord has it, you can just throw an expendable unit at him, forcing him to use the weapon and perhaps kill himself in the process. If a Hero has it, it is extremely suicidal as he can't afford a ward save on top. I'm liking that it is the best weapon available for the WoC, but I think the rules will ned to be changed for it to be of much value. Maybe less powerful but the drawback relating to the Eyes of the Gods table instead of killing yourself so easily.
-Archaon: Chosen of the Gods, last sentence should read: "In addition, Archaon must re-roll any result of 2 or 12 on the Eyes of the Gods table. The idea that he can end up as a spawn or a demon prince is entirely out of character due to his relationship with the dark gods.
-Crom:
1. Master of Chaos Undivided sucks, due to units already having the will of chaos. Maybe allowing units with the Will of the Gods special rule some other buff or option would be better and more interesting.
2. Encorcelled Blades (If he joined Archaon's Swords of Chaos for ages and was his best, it is kind of odd that he runs around with mundane weapons).
3. Immense Pride is good, but The Way of the Warrior is rather dissapointing I think. With a magic weapon I think things would look a little better, but even then I'd still amke his Parry a 4+ to make it worthwhile.
-Kordel Shorgar: With the Stubborn added to MoF, it seems a bit odd that such a "unifying" banner holds so little value for the followers of one of the gods. Maybe "Suicidal courage" could be represented in some other fashion?
-Did you consider making Valkia Daemonic instead of buffing her armour? Not sure if you might have overlooked the suggestion.
-I liked the idea of giving Wulfrik Killing Blow in challenges. A little worried that it might cause 6's on the to would roll be more normal than not though (due to pretty much always hitting and re-rolling to wound rolls). Perhaps letting him hit and wound on 2+ in challenges would balance it out a bit, and also make him a bit differnt from Crom.
-Throgg: He is quite insane for a Hero really. If you buy him, you pretty much are committing yourself to a Monstrous Infantry type army anyway, so why not give him +1W and make him a proper Lord?
-Mantle of Chaos: Dividing by 2, means S2 for Both Bows and Crossbows/Handguns, which again translates to wounding warriors of chaos on 6's. You are pretty much making them immune at that point, as it also affects armour saves. Even most war machines become pointless. I still really dislike this power as it is so incredibly effective at protecting against one of the few weaknesses the list has and is supposed to have. It still costs 50 pts btw.
-Distendable MAw: Ok, I know the chance isn't great, but against some armies (Dwarves, Lizardmen etc) this power can be a bit OP I think... Ther is simply no way of really defending yourself against it from a character design perspective, which makes me rather sceptical about it tbh. I love that you removed it from the Tzeentch powers though.
-Hellshriek: It doesn't say how strong the miscast is. If you can only get result 1-6 on the table, it's not really that bad.. Perhaps adding their own Wizard Level to a D6 roll could be appropriate.
Good points overall. Regarding the distenable maw while its good against those armies. Its nigh useless against many armies as well (elves in general) adding a save will further weaken it against them.
DeleteI think the hellshriek is intentionally not meant to go past 1-6 otherwise it would utterly broken imo. Especially against vampires who often get in close range with their wizards.
I actually think the daemonsword is pretty good for its price, its high risk and high reward which fits WoC, sure it might kill you, its its a very powerful weapon. I believe the dark elf hydrasword is just d6 attacks for a similar price which doesnt kill you and has no strength modifier.
I somewhat agree on the mantle of chaos but Im not sure how to fix it :/
- I suppose they can keep it then, probably makes more sense anyway.
Delete- Will Fix.
- Just stick a decent ward save on the guy and the odds of him killing himself is pretty low. Putting it on a hero, well...
- I can make it so that he re-rolls those two, sure. Then there's still a chance, but a small one.
- Giving him free acccess to elite marauders is fine. Crom does not really use any magical weapons though, that's kind of his thing.
- Maybe Unbreakable then, that's still useful for Slaanesh? Double unit strength is okay, but it does not really fit the fluff all that well. Maybe double unit strenght for the purpose of being steadfast could work, but at that point they might as well be stubborn. MoS won't really get a boost from that apart from the +1 combat res from outnumber, and that does not really make sense since the opponents does not think of them as being twice their number.
- Valkia has never really been Daemonic in the sense that she was made a Daemon Prince(ss) though, so I don't think it really fits.
- Could make it 2+ to Hit and to Wound instead, sure.
- Don't think Throgg fits that well as a Lord really. He is a lot more expensive now at least.
- I could make it 55 pts again, but otherwise I think it's okay as you can only have one in your army. Since the models have a 1+ armour save against missiles anyway with shields, I don't think this will that much play unless you know you'll be going up against missile heavy armies.
- It's very situational though, and only works against Infantry.
- It could pretty much be used to shut down an enemy magic phase even with those results though, don't want to make it too punishing.
- Armour-wise, the gorebeast is really the same though, and a 2+ save feels a bit much. At +1W and 3 S5 attacks, I think it would be different enough.
- The model wield them in one hand as they have a shield in the other though, and they hold them like spears in the artwork.
- Making them have immunity is fine by me, no need to really overcomplicate it.
- Most warshrines are rare choices in other armies, and I don't really want to be a unit that gets spammed. Re-rolling charges are still useful as you get to use it the turn after, before the next magic phase when it stops working. ASF does not really fit with the fluff for the spell though, favour of khorne already gives re-roll to Hit. Fluffwise, it should really be something about leadership of psychology. Maybe unbreakable for slaanesh, stubborn for everyone else?
-Crom: I know skill vs. items was part of Vrom's charm, but his rules are not good enough by far to justfiy taking him instead of a regular chaos lord. What does he really have outside of duelss? +1 WS and +1 Attack/+1 to Parry above what you can normally get with mundane weapons/shield? That's what worth around 30 pts? A regular Chaos Lord would be better off investing in protection and a simple great weapon for a comparable cost.
DeleteArmour has increased for infantry (pretty much every character in the game with the exception of qizards and some Wood Elves ones perhaps), so his mundane weapons is a bigger drawback than they used to be. Encorceleld weapons would compensate for that without giving him the option of stacking something unreasonable on top of his special rules.
-You can also easily argue that Valia is no longer mortal from her lore though.. She was killed and remade by Khorne after all. I'd say that would make her more demonic than mortal, but it is somewhat of a grey area.
In any case, due to how you'd play her becasue of her wings (lone character), I think Daemonic would fit a bit better as it would alos offer her a bit of protection in hth against non-magical weapons, so that she could better stand up against units as well alone (she will have to beat a lot of static CR on her own a lot I imagine). I haven't played her though, to be perfectly clear, as Khorne hasn't really been my thing, but due to her frenzy and really only being "safe" once in clombat anyway, I imagne a 5+ ward save against non-magical attacks there would be a welcome addition.
-Not really sure how you can think Throgg does not fit as a Lord tbh, as he is a major character in the lore, king of trolls, has all th stats apart from correct wounds etc. He is is just as out of place as a Hero as Krell is imo. No big deal for me though, as I don't have the model and fielding a full monstrous horde isn't really my thing in any case.
-I think you're not seeing the whole picture regarding hte mantle of chaos Mathias. It is NOT the shield and hand weapon warroros of chaos that is an issue, it is taking it with a unit of WoC/Chosen with MoK and Great Weapons for example. Such a unit only losing a few models before they enter close combat is almost unstoppable.
'd not bother with using it on a WoC unit with hand weapons and Shields, as they are good against missiles in any case. I'd not pay 50-55 pts to make sure I'd not lose a few models of them as thay cross the gaming table. It is a power that significantly increases the value of going all-out with offensive buff stacks, as you pretty much guarantee that you get across the board safely anyway.
-Regarding hte Hellshriek, is it a D6 roll on the miscast table only though? It only says it is a miscast, but since you now normally roll a d6+PD used (and you don't use any PD in the opponent's phase), it comes off as a bit weak perhaps, especially for an expensive one use ability.
-The Gorebeast chariot might be the same model (it really shouldn't be from a lore perspective, but it is from a model perspective). Ther is still some justification from claiming more arour on the gorebeast itself when compared to barding on warhorses though, since the armour represent armour on the whole model as a whole.
Delete-You can Hold a Halberd in one hand when not in use though and a shield is still somewthing you could have strapped to your arm. You'd not get to use it in hth offcourse, but the model clearly has what would be a halberd in the old days and a glaive now (also a polearm).
-The Warshrine used to be Special in 8th ed. It is not really a unit that you'd benefit much from spamming in any case. It is a support unit and you'd never win a game by spamming support units. It is too cheap to be rare arguably, but more importantly, it will just drown in that Rare section I think.
Didn't you write the fluff for the spell? I don't see why that can't be changed to match the rule, rather than vice-versa.
Unbreakable/Stubborn sems reasonable though, but one thing I'm a bit uncomfortable with is the notion that a warshrine of Khorne for example would bless warriors with the mark of another god. That seems like it takes thinga bit too far. Do you think that Warshrines wdedicated to a particular Chaos God should only really support units with their own god's mark? To me that makes the most sense and it would also be a nice encouragement to create more themeatic armies.
- I'd say 7 S5 attacks that can re-roll both To Wound and To Wound is pretty good. He's pretty cheap for the cost as well, though I'd look over his points with the change of master of chaos undivided. I could boost him to 8A/4+ parry like in End Times, but that feels a bit excessive.
Delete- Daemonic is a plain 5+ ward though, including against magical attacks. As there's nothing in the lore that says she has become a Daemon Prince or similar, I'd rather not give that special rule. She is T5 with a 1+ save that both reduces incoming attaks and strength, so she not that easy to kill in combat as is.
- Like Krell, Throgg is not really a general though unless you are playing a pure monster list, and they have enough Lord choices as is imo. Being a hero or lord won't really have much of an effect on the list building anyway, it would mainly be Throgg being higher stats.
- I am aware of that build, but seeing as it is a 0-1 power that requires a lord to get it, I don't think it would be too bad. Noone else have complained about it, and I cannot really find any complains about from 7th ed either (where it was -2 S on average rather than -1 for bows). I could maybe make it not work against magical attacks if you think it's too strong, that way both magic missiles and magic arrows won't be bothered by it.
- Hellshriek works the same as the Hellheart though, but with a longer range. I'd still say it's worth it if you know you'll be going up against a missile heavy army.
- The Gorebeast pretty much have "free" barding though, that it won't lose Movement from. I would not say that the gorebeast is more heavily armoured than the normal chariot in that sense. It being heavier is already represented with the extra wound.
- Fine, can make it a halberd then.
- It used to be Rare in 7th ed ;) The rare section is mainly intended for troops that you'd want to field in some greater numbers, whereas rare is mainly for single models or super-elites. There's hardly any other army out there with shrines in the special section (Bretonnia and VC would come to mind, but their shrines are very weak). I think it mainly comes down to what sort of army you want to build; if you want to go heavy on monsters, a warshrine does not fit anyway. The Mark of Chaos rule prohibits casting spells on units with other Marks already through the Allies rules, you gotta give me some credit ;)
As for the lore of the warshrine; it was written by GW, so I'd rather keep it.
Delete-The 7 S5 attacks with re-rolls are only in challenges though, not for regular combat. and that is assuming you have no Parry save at all in hth. Most lords with decent armour and a ward save will easily survive that onslought for a round or two as well and probably hit back just as hard, if not harder.
Delete-Not saying that she is a demon prince (not that she can become one or a spawn with her rules either), but she is closer to one than she is a mere mortal at this point. The chaos gods don't ressurect and "re-shape" mortals as they like that often in the lore either. Just saying that ther is enough of a grey in her case to go both ways and then to me it comes down to which rules suit her best.
-Throgg sure is a general in the End times lore. Not the smartest one granted, but that can be said for any orc general as well.. :-P
You point is true regarding the stats though etc, but due to reduced effect of Regeneration as well, he kind of could use another wound as well imo.
And as a side note, Krell has been a general many times in the lore, both before and after Kemmler (if one includes the End Times).
-I think it is justified worrying about it personally, just because it reinforces and encourages the deathstar type gameplay, which from what I remember was one of your goals of avoiding/reducing in 9th.
I suspect that it is not entirely unlikely that you can have players that play WoC themselves that keep quiet on the issue as well, due to wanting to keep it in for themselves.
-So just to clarify, you roll a single D6 on the miscast table, with no additions, for both the Hellshriek and Hellheart, where it used to be 2d6? Don't get me wrong, the Hellheart was massively OP in 8th, so I'm not sad to se a nerf, but I'm not sure 50 pts for a one off use in the case of the hellshriek is very appealing either if it is only a D6 that you roll anda Power Drain (lose D3 PD) is the best result you can theoretically achieve. I presume you meant magic heavy army btw :-)
-"Barding" is a bit vague when it comes to armour value. I mean, an Empire Warhorse can have most of its body covered by full plate efectively, yet the legs remains vulernable, but in either case all Bardings only provide 1 point of armour. A Gorebeast I'd view a bit more like a Monstrous Beast withy combined thick skin and far heavier/thicker and more all-encompassing (at least from most viable angles of attack) armour than you'd see on a warhorse.
I think the justification is there for the beast and for the chariot as wel lfroma lore perspective, but more importantly, it would make it more unique in terms of gameplay.
-Yay! :-P
-Ahh! Been a while since I brushed up on the Allies rules tbh. Haven't had much use for them yet. :-)
I apologize if I can come of as your biggest critic at times Mathias. You know I love what you do and honestly I only try to help make the game better by keeping you on your toes and when the chance is there, to actually fix things wher I think GW originally made not the best decision from the game (and they have been known to make a few, sometimes quite deliberate ones to boost sales of some expensive models and the like).
-Warshrine Lore: I thought you had written the lore for the individual god type boosts for the warshrine in 9th, as that did not exist in 8t hed. That was the lore part I referred to just to be clear. :-) My point was that that could easily be changed for Slaanesh to make the rule work better for the Slaanehs buff if indeed it was your lore.
DeleteIf it is something you brought back from 7th ed (I have stowed away most of my pre-8th ed books), there is still justification ot change it as needed though, as GW already changed that part out for 8th ed themselves. I think you have some leeway to work with in regards to the lore if needed was my point. :-)
-Gorebeast Chariot: I thought it would get more armour. +1W is fine, but a 2+ armour save would be more appropriate. 130 pts was the old one that had +1T (which is comparatively speaking much better). This supposed "heavier" chariot from the lore must be heavier for a reason as well, otherwise the Gorebeast would not be needed to pull it in the first place...
ReplyDelete-Fatemasters: Fireglaives are still Spears? A Glaive is a polearm I'd argue and the models have Polarms.
-Dragon Ogres: Storm Rage is actually in a way even worste thn it used to be, as there is even less of en incentive to use any Lightning based Attack on them. They might as well carry a big sign 2cast lignting bolts at me stupid". They are immune ot the effect, so no one will ever cast Lightning type spells/attacks at them regardless, so the buffs on top are even more pointelss.
They might as well just have Immunity (Lightning Attacks) and leave it at that.
Will take a second look at points etc a bit later.
-An option for Crom could be to make Elite Marauders available without restrictions, to build on his leader of the Kul (Kurgan) idea. The Kurgan are supposed to be big enough to intimidate the norse even, so it makes a bit os sense from that aspect as well. I also imagine he has access to a larger than average recruitment pool and this access to more elites than normal. That would potentially make him a bit more intersting, rather than just stacking anti-panic buffs.
ReplyDeleteConcerning Lizardmen, how were the lores Heavens and Beasts determined?
ReplyDeleteNot sure what you mean. Are you asking why they have access to those two lores?
DeleteYes and not others.
DeleteIt was really just a matter of what would make sense. The Slann can take all lores, the skinks can choose the ones that fit with their aztec background. A Skink alchemist? Would be pretty weird.
DeleteI see. So it is not because of some GW precedent?
DeleteI could see them using Lore of Light, but maybe not?
-Warshrine: I think it is better suited as a Special option. The Slaanesh version still seems very weak comparably speaking. How would you even re-rol la charge distance when the magic phase is after the movement phase? The re-roll psychology tests don't even apply to MoS models. re-rolling break tests is conditioned upon you getting the spell of and then losing a combat round, in which case you still have Stubborn (and possibly a BSB). Re-rolling pursuit ranges is a bit meh and only really relevent if you win in the first place...
ReplyDeleteHaving it do something like grant ASF would be much more useful, epspecially for the models that the Slaanesh type Warshrine is thematically supposed to follow. If ASF fist is to good for some reason, then maybe an initiative bonus and Armour Piercing could be an option.
-an idea struck me regarding Kordel Shorgaars Banner. Instead of Stubborn, who not let friendly units within 6" double their effective unit strength? This will help against outnumbering and easier provide Steadfast. It will also give MoS units a bit more of a potential boost as well, or at least be useful to them.
ReplyDeleteAs an additional note, it seems that the rule regarding Marks replacing Will of Chaos was omitted. Or maybe I'm just not looking in the right places.
ReplyDelete-Since Fatemasters wield Fireglaives which are Halberds, I think that Chaos Sorcerers should have access to weapon options.
ReplyDelete-Hellstriders are Marauders on Steeds of Slaanesh so Marauder Chieftains should have the option to ride a Steed of Slaanesh.
-Hellstriders should also have the option to upgrade to elite marauders.
-War Mammoths still have the "Mark of Chaos Undivided" special rule in the army lists section.
-Perhaps Bloodcurdling Roar could be made to function like a Breath Weapon that has unlimited uses and cannot be used in close combat?
-How old is Galrauch? Maybe he could have the statline of a Moon Dragon with +1 attack due to an additional head.
-I meant to say Star Dragon in the case of Galrauch.
Delete- Fate Masters are not normal sorcerers.
Delete- Hellstriders are already "elite" as is, don't think they need another mount option.
- Don't think that fits since the Chieftain does not get any of the other Hellstrider rules.
- Will fix.
- Would not really fit I think, since it's not something he really "vomits" on them as such. While a roar might technically be heard by all within X", I think it works okay as it is now.
- Rather not mess with his stats as such, there's nothing saying he was a star dragon, and he is expensive enough already.
Just noticed the last update and I've got to say you added a few nice touches there Mathias. The Sigwald fix seems very appropriate (with his shield he actually seems rather decent now tbh). I liked the nurgle Palanquin fix. Valkia fix was nice. Viletich fix sems very appropriate...
ReplyDeleteThere are still a few minor things here and there, but I think you have nailed most of the fluff part in terms of rules and so on. The remaining things are mostly minor balancing issues and the like, which there always are, but the list looks fun to try out and start game-testing :-)
Ther is still one unit in the book that I think could still do with an overhaul/simplification though, and that is the Mutalith vortex beast in terms of it's rather comlicated special rule and what I still expect won't be a unit that sees much play, even with the wound increase. I was hoping that someone with more gameplay experience wwith the unit would have told us of his/her experiences on the discord channel, to get a better perspective on it, but no-one really seems to play it it seems. Still, it has gotten a wound upgrade and maybe that will tempt some to try it out and offer some feedback :-)
Is there any official models for chaos cultists other than the 3rd ed RR16 "disciples of red redemption (also branded as "chaos monks")? Anyway those models (the troopers) are armed with shields and 1h-flails. They also wear chain mail shirts under their robes. If I ever play a chaos warriors list I would like to dig up my old redemptionists from the drawers and play them as WYSIWYG;).
ReplyDeleteNot that I know of, but the Frostgrave cultists should fit the bill nicely. Might add shields as an option for them.
DeleteAbout Magic Resistance. Some special characters have a Ward Save and Magic Resistance (3) (such as that granted by the Triskele from Albion). Some of those characters would have Ward Saves of 2+ or 3+ against magic spells if their Ward Save and Magic Resistance stacked. Does Magic Resistance allow a model to have a Ward Save above the maximum limit? If not, then there isn't really a point about the character having a Ward Save and Magic Resistance that strong.
ReplyDeleteThe limit is 4+ like normal ward saves, but MR also affects the unit they join, so it's still useful.
DeleteThe mark of tzeentch can be combined with another ward save? (for example the daemon prince has 4+ ward save?)
ReplyDeleteYes, it's in the main 9th ed rules.
DeleteShrinemaster pag 193 has 2 attacks;
ReplyDeleteShrinemaster pag 266 has 3 attacks.
What is the correct value?
What is Sentient Special Rule, that Dragon Ogres have? Can't find it in book nor RB.
ReplyDeleteStorm Rage - can't find it anywhere, but Kholek Lord of the Storm special rule says something about it.
In army List, Dragon Ogres have Storm Rage rule, but it is nowhere explained.
What base Mammoth should use? And Kholek, for that matter - I'm pretty sure DO were selled with 50x75, but Shaggoth - 50x50, and it looks a little stupid for me.
In changelog there is this point:
Delete- Taking a Mark of Chaos replaces the Will of Chaos special rule.
But there is no such thing in book itself.
- Valkia has a 5+ ward save, 350 pts.
- Valkia has A5, 335 pts.
Erm... so which one? In book is 350, but changelog is confusing.
I today founded this site, will look at few books and Rulebook in search of such... simple and sometimes stupid (no offense intented) mistakes.
Although maybe there is some easier way to post then in comments?
Well since the books appeared on battlescribe I had a little look over, as mainly a Khorne player, my focus was more on them.
ReplyDeleteI really like the new magic items, its nice to see a return of some of the old 6th ed items, I always loved the crown of everlasting conquest, the little tweak is nice.
Slaughterpriests are a much needed addition, they work well with the changes to MR (the 6th/7th ed way was for more useful).
Are skullreapers and Blightnights still on 40mm bases? If so, I don't think they are going to work as infantry, its hard to get the rank bonus or enough models into bases to base. Might these not work better as MI light?
Skullcrushers should essentially be Khorne Chosen knights, thats essentially why they are worthy enough to ride juggers, It was strange GW gave them the same stats as a warrior, its still a little strange you've followed the trend (they are a rare unit after all).
I'm not really sure about the shrines, while I agree that having unique effects is cool, perhaps they need to be a little more different? A khorne one could equally be a constant anti-magic effect?
Its great you've brought back the bloodbeasts, 8th ed Khorne spawn are awful.
Its also cool that you've fixed the daemon sword, only thing you're really missing is something like the Axe of Khorne (and perhaps some unqiue daemon prince mutations.