Thursday, 23 June 2016

Albion, Amazons and Araby 9th Ed and 8th ed update out now!

Updated  6/7

Some smaller updates here, changing the following apart from adding a 9th ed version. The plan is add 9th ed updates in 3's. Do not expect any larger changes in these updates, right now I'm working mainly on having the 9th ed versions out so I can get to working on the full versions of the official books.


  • Cheaper characters, does not have LA by default. 
  • Cheaper fen-beast upgrades.
  • Access to Lore of Light.
  • Wizards have weapon options.
  • Oathsworn are stubborn.


  • Coatl and Medusa removed. Coatl fits better in the LM book, and Medusa are already in the DE book.
  • Koka-kalim moved to special.
  • Terradon Riders moved to rare, 2W.
  • Cheaper special characters. 
  • Jaguar Warriors ambush for free.
  • Jungle Stalkers 12 pts.
  • Cavalry have short bows.
  • Culchan Riders 16 pts.
  • Cold Ones have A2, Cold One Riders 19 pts, spears are an upgrade.
  • Boosted the Lore of the Serpent spells.


  • Nerfed Sandglass of Time spell.
  • Cheaper artefacts of the creed.
  • Hashishin does not ward saves by default.
  • War Elephants does not have natural armour (lacking both scales and thick fur).
  • Mamelukes have spears by default.


  1. Suggestions for Albion:
    -Druids should have the statline of a Priestess from the Amazons and Truthsayers should have the statline of a Serpent Priestess from the Amazons. They are both battlemages of a sorts and what I'm proposing would fit the typical progression of wizard lords having +1 toughness compared to their hero counterparts.
    -Hurled Heads causing a -1 leadership penalty for each hit sounds like a quick way to cause leadership to lower all the way to one. Causing panic tests will work better.
    -What is wrong with just giving Oathsworn Stubborn? The Bodyguard special rule will also make it incredibly easy to kite them with ranged units and of questionable usefulness when lacking a character.
    -Since you didn't like the previous rules for how monster mounts also mean having an on foot model available you should make it that Warriors of Danu always use the Spasm Warrior profile and possess Hatred and Frenzy. Either that or make them like Alter Kin from the Wood Elves.
    -Perhaps Leechloam could work based on how strong the winds of magic are instead with winds of 7 or above granting the bonus. It doesn't make much sense for a druid using a life spell on the other side of the battlefield to affect the Fenbeasts.
    -Since the Sidhe have each house related to one of the elements of the world perhaps they should have upgrades based on each of the classical elements. Fire grants +1 strength and flaming attacks, Earth grants Regeneration (5+), Air grants Hover and Water grants Always Strikes First.
    -Shouldn't Mastodon riders be nobility just like Clansman Cavalry and therefore, WS4?
    -For Gwenlaen, her Sword of Ogma should grant Devastating Charge and Charge Bonus (2). Just a nitpick but you should use existing rules if possible.
    -I always figured that the Army specific lores are all created by weaving together a few of the typical lores just like how high magic involves weaving together every lore, the exceptions being chaos magic, orc and goblin magic, dark magic and the lore of stromfels. Because of that, I think that Truthsayers and Druids should have access to the Lore of Light since Light of Battle and Boon of Courage function like certain spells from the lore of light and Voice of Command questionably so.
    -You still haven't removed the rule barring mounted characters from taking an additional hand weapon.
    -Why wouldn't Conor Macfeud use a shield alongside his magic weapon?
    -Why is Amanthas T3 when all characters from Albion are T4?
    -The Mastodon in the mounts section has the Howdah Crew special rule despite it being removed.
    -I still think that Warband Warriors and Woad Raiders should be upgradeable to WS4.
    -Chariots are missing their information on how many horses they are drawn by and how many riders they have.
    -If Neophytes have weapon options then Druids and Truthsayers should have the same options.
    -Doesn't a Giant usually cost 200pts? Why is it cheaper for Albion?

    1. Great suggestions.
      Also Im suggesting to give Halfgiants +2 MS

      Also a question about woad paint - does it still add +1 to any ward save what unit is having (parry chance with shield as example)

    2. - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - They are still infantry, so you do not need to change models.
      - Fixed.
      - Maybe in the future.
      - Not really, they are just basic warriors, like Skinks and Stegadons.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Seen Highlander? He's too cool for a shield!
      - Fixed, also nerfed WS, I and A.
      - Fixed.
      - They are not nobles, so should have weaker stats.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Giants are getting an overall price drop in all books, Beastmen already has it.

    3. - Why would Half Giants have WS5 when normal giants and ogres only have WS3?
      - Yes, I've added that in.

    4. -Truthsayers and Druids are missing access to shields. The Truthsayer is also still BS3 and lacks access to the Lore of Light. The Halberd option for both of them says "Halberds" plural.
      -Speaking of which, if Halberds are available to the Shamans then why aren't those available to Warband Warriors, Oathsworn, Swordmaidens, Centaurs and Warriors of Danu?
      -I think what KoziorecPax was saying is that Half Giants should be Movement 4 like most Monstrous Infantry.

    5. - They do use shields, they use either sickles or heavy bladed staffs. Only the Neophytes use smaller shields at times.
      - Druid staffs are not exactly commonly used among non-druids ;)
      - Ah, that would make more sense, I thought he meant "melee skill" or something like that. Fixed it now.

    6. This comment has been removed by the author.

    7. hmm another two suggestions;

      - At the start of Albion Army List we have Army List Entries where the representation of old Warband Warrior is used. He is costing there only 4pts and now it is 5pts.
      - Why not give centaurs and half giants option to carry a magic standart? They seem more elite than Clansmen cavalary or Swordmaidens, but they do not have acces to it.

    8. Hi. It appears that Cormac has been given Conors Light Armour as Cormac has it along with his Magic Armour.

  2. Suggestions for the Amazons:
    -Thalestris's transformation should be voluntary. It's supposed to help her whenever she is put into a bad spot but when fighting multi-wound models or ones with high armor saves it'll be detrimental.
    -Lwaxana's voodoo dolls shouldn't work against undead, lizardmen or daemons for obvious reasons.
    -Azura's Mesmerizing Dance says that units that are Immune to Psychology are unaffected.
    -Why doesn't the Azure Fire from Azura have Armor Piercing (1). Sunstaffs will pierce heavy armor so I don't understand why Azure Fire wouldn't.
    -Why wouldn't Pentheselia hate elven males or dwarven males?
    -Throatslicer and the Sun Sword do not specify how good they are at parrying though I assume it's a 6+.
    -Shouldn't Skypiercer pierce ranks like a bolt thrower instead of automatically piercing all ranks?
    -The Lore of the Serpent doesn't seem to have any elements of the Lore of Light in it so I would replace it with the Lore of the Shadows which it does have an element of in the form of Siren's Dream. Same reason as for Albion.
    -Currently, characters cannot take Crystaline Armor due to not normally having access to medium armor. A single sentence added to Crystaline Armor's effects can fix that.
    -Why wouldn't Thalestris, Azura and Lysippe wield a shield alongside their magic weapons?
    -How come Terradon's aren't available as a mount for characters?
    -Old one treasures should be a special/rare/character exclusive thing, not available to the core eagle warriors but accessible to Culchan and Terradon Riders.
    -Perhaps give Jungle Stalkers the ability to replace their bows and poisoned attacks with Sun Staffs. Also, does their Multiple Shots special rule mean that they can fire multiple shots after moving?
    -The Noblewomen riding Cold Ones should be WS5, S4. That way, they would have a noticeable superiority to jaguar riders in ability and would mean that their power doesn't come exclusively from the mount.
    -I'm not quite sure why Gorols would be Ld6.

    1. - Fixed.
      - Added "other small piece". Some undead and daemons do have hair!
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - It's mainly humans who raid near the Amazons.
      - Fixed.
      - I prefer it to work a bit differently.
      - Light fits with their Sunstaffs, and the Aztecs worshipped a sun god. Shadow less so.
      - Fixed.
      - They are too cool for that, same as several elector counts.
      - Terradons are a specialised harassment unit, it does not quite fit for their lords to fly into battle.
      - Eagle Warriors are elite core warriors, that's why they can use sunstaffs. Culchan riders and Jungle Stalkers are from more primitive tribes that have adopted the bows as their weapons.
      - Sunstaffs are not part of their tribe's culture. Also, yes.
      - WS5 for humans is too much except for the most elite warriors. You already have the elite totem guards with those stats, I don't want the Cold One Riders to be superiour in every regard.
      - What Ld value should they have then?

    2. -The Bright Staff uses obsolete Rules since it possesses Armor Piercing (-2) rather than Armor Piercing (2).
      -Maybe Jungle Stalkers should just have a rule that say that they fire one additional shot more than normal when firing their bows. It would give them a reason to stay still.

    3. - Will update that one later, very minor issue.
      - They still suffer to hit penalties for moving and shooting, so there's still a point to standing still, but they are meant to be a mobile unit.

    4. -Cold One Riders still say that they may swap Spears for Claws of the Old Ones in their options section.
      -Huntresses should be able to upgrade their hand weapon to a spear.

    5. I didn't notice earlier but The Cobra Staff has the same problem as The Bright Staff.

  3. Suggestions for Araby:
    -Palace Guard are Stubborn by default so it's redundant for a Sultan to grant them that.
    -Camel Riders and Bedoiun Raiders no longer need to be Toughness 4 since it would now be granted by their Camel.
    -Shouldn't Carpet Riders use BS instead of WS when Carpet Bombing? They are using a throwing weapon and all other throwing weapons use BS.
    -Didn't you make Hidden a rulebook special rule? Why does the Prince of Thieves have an explanation for it.
    -Mirage states that units that are Immune to Psychology are immune to the spell.
    -The Bow of Seeking has no representation to its fluff. Replace Multiple Wounds with it ignoring To Hit penalties.
    -Salah Ad-Din should be the exception to how Sultan Jaffar prevents any other special characters from being in the same army.
    -Jezzails, and a Siphon and Naffatun should be ranged weapon options for Caliphs and Sheikhs.
    -Again, why wouldn't Salah Ad-Din wield a shield.
    -Camel Riders should just be Ambushers.
    -Since Flying Carpets are considerably more common in Araby, Sheikhs, Caliphs and Sultans should have access to those.
    -Flying Carpets for character mounts should have Carpet Bombing.
    -It should be possible for War Elephant Riders to upgrade their Short Bows to Handguns.

    1. -It shouldn't be mandatory for a Sultan to be placed in a unit of palace guards. Sultan's should also have the typical mount options and their purchased title should not count towards the limit of magic items.

    2. - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Not necessarily since Drop rocks no not work that way, and making them autohit removes the use of poison. I like the idea of them working liek missile weapons though, added that.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Saladin never fought with Jaffar, so it fits.
      - These are specialised weapons, not something that any lord would carry into battle.
      - Because rule of cool! Might add it in in the future.
      - Fixed.
      - Fixed.
      - Carpet bombs have nothing to do with the carpets themselves, they are merely weapons used by carpet riders.
      - Handguns are only used by Janissaries, other units use short bows.
      - Sultans should be looked at in the same way as Slann, putting them on other mounts and units would go against that. Since they are not casters or fighters, letting the Titles be part of their magic allowances is not an issue, the only other thing they have use for is talismans and enchanted items.

    3. Been reading throught whole book and this fell into my eyes:
      Unit from Army list: Mamelukes
      equipment: Lance
      options: may replace spears with lances for 1pt.
      Conclusion: They do not have spears anymore

    4. -In the army list section, Camel Riders are not Ambushers.

    5. - Mamelukes have spears, not lances.
      - Camel Riders have ambushers by default (9th age).

    6. This comment has been removed by the author.

  4. Furthermore, for Albion units, their Woad Paint differs greatly in price for the same bonus. A Warleader should not have to pay 15 times the cost of Woad Paint that a single Warband Warrior has to.

    1. I think it works as is. 15pts is the normal cost of the 6+ Ward Save Talisman in 8th. The 1pt cost for regular 1 W models is just so that its economical, e.g. a 6+ Ward Save could save a 5pt cannon fodder Warrior while on a Lord or Hero that Ward Save could save a 150+ Model.
      - EdwardX

    2. Alright, fair enough. I can understand the economic side of it, but then 10% of the warleader is added in the bonus (15 vs 150). Then should the paint be the same 10% for other units? Eg. 1/5 a point per 5 pt warrior?

    3. Ward save 6+ have always been 15 pts for characters, for units its around 1-1,5 pts. Just following the established pattern here.

  5. When you'll make Tomb Kings I suggest you to consider couple things:

    - Make them to be able to perform stand & shoot
    - Add javelin options. I'm thinking chariot units, characters and maybe even horsemen.

    I guess you'll understand why I suggest those two, because those two works together. Either that or give Tomb Kings some special javelin (maybe +1 to hit), because with the current rules they would be useless over the bows. Or make the most radical thing and remove the arrows of asaph :D

  6. please (when you do araby) could you let them keep their special repeeter crossbow.

    1. You mean Cathay? Yes, they will keep their unique crossbow :)

  7. Why did you drop the Coatl? The Lizardmen have loads of options already and it gave the Amazons something fantastical. you already have them on Terradons and coldones - it is increasingly like human shaped skinks.

  8. Yeah, I'm not too happy about *removing* options for any army, especially one as limited in options as Amazons. Let them have this one monster. The Coatl is smart enough to work for any non-evil force it finds.
    Same for the Medusa. Have Amazon medusas be the default two-legged ones and Dark Elf Bloodwrack ones be the ones with snake tails.

    1. Thing is, the Coatl was only added to the Amazons because it was missing from the official LM book. Since I can now make my own LM book, the Coatl fits a lot better there. The official fluff actually speaks of Amazons hunting the Coatl, so it makes much more sense for it to be in the LM book than the Amazon book.

      The Medusa too fitted okay with the whole serpent theme, but fits less so since DE is the army with the Greek monsters, whereas Amazons are really based on Aztecs/Mayans.

  9. your Fluff arguments make sense but there is an army balance issue here. The Amazons are too light and could do with something fantastical, a centre piece. The lizardmen are the otherway, they have too much in that category. I think a little thought needs to go into splitting these two factions a little, this might involve inventing / twisting the very old Amazon fluff

    1. The Amazons do have the Avatar of Rigg as their centrepiece, so it's there. That's one of the main difference between the two armies as well, Lizardmen have lots of monsters and can slug it out in prolonged combat, whereas Amazons are more about gerilla warfare. If the Amazons also have a ton of monsters, they pretty much play the same. Twisting the fluff is something I am not a fan off, since that is pretty much the opposite idea of doing the project in the first place.

    2. I am a major fluff fan and my forces are usually lousy on the table top because of it. The issues that I have with the amazons are the cold one riders and the terradon riders. Have them riding giant Macaws or something but the overlap to the lizardmen is too strong. The Coatl was a one off, a sentient creature too, not another lumbering monster, and the lizardmen doesn't need any more of them.

    3. I kind of feel like the Elephant's Stampede is problematic in its implementation. Several things I can imagine are issues are:

      -In a mirror-match, the Elephant charges a unit of Desert Cavalry, that fire and flee. Does the Stampede take precedence over the flee reaction?
      -What happens if a Stampeding Elephant moves through a friendly unit, but does not have enough space to come out the other side?

      I kind of like the idea of the Elephant working more like the Dervish, while the Dervish unit either has ease with combat reform, or the ability to "sidestep" in an ongoing melee to open charge lanes for supporting units.